Archive for lang.myfreeforum.org Lang smoker cookers
 


       lang.myfreeforum.org Forum Index -> Ask about Lang Cookers
medic smoker

paint on the fire box.?

i just went and picked up my 36 stretch this past week ( 36 hours and 1200 miles later).  Finally, Got it home and seasoned it.  The paint on the top and sides of the fire box, as well on the bottom of the warmer box connected to the fire box, started to bubble and flake off in spots.  is that normal.?  has anyone had this happen.?

Before I departed Lang shop, one of the works told me that they were out of paint to touch up a few spots, but if i called up Ben, they would mail me out a can of paint.
Wood River BBQ Team

Re: paint on the fire box.?

medic smoker wrote:
i just went and picked up my 36 stretch this past week ( 36 hours and 1200 miles later). Finally, Got it home and seasoned it. The paint on the top and sides of the fire box, as well on the bottom of the warmer box connected to the fire box, started to bubble and flake off in spots. is that normal.? has anyone had this happen.?

Before I departed Lang shop, one of the works told me that they were out of paint to touch up a few spots, but if i called up Ben, they would mail me out a can of paint.



It is a normal occurence on my cooker because the fire box temperatures are very high. I don't know what kind of paint Lang uses or how many coats they apply. I couldn't read the label on the paint can that came with my Lang - the can was used to protect the fire box door handle.

Since I have a Santa Maria style grill sitting on the fire box the flaking doesn't stand out but when I get sick of looking at the mess I sand it down to bare metal (it only takes a few minutes) and repaint it using Ace Hardware high temp 1000* paint, which doesn't last.

Next Time I'm going to try AutoZone 2000* Thermo Tec or O'Reilly's VHT Ceramic Header 2000* Paint ($8.99). Another forum turned me on to those 2 products.

I don't know anything about powder coating but I wonder if Lang powder coated their units if the fire box paint would stand up better to the high temp? My neighbor has a Peoria Custom Cooker (same size as my cooker but twice the cost) and his fire box doesn't flake -- I don't know what Peoria's paint process is.
Okeeffe

Could you post results if you try the alternate paints and let us know how it went?
medic smoker

i will keep yall posted when i paint it and how its holding up. I am going to give it a few more cooks to burn off the paint.  2 cooks into it and 80% of the paint  on the fire box has flaked off.
Wood River BBQ Team

medic smoker wrote:
i will keep yall posted when i paint it and how its holding up. I am going to give it a few more cooks to burn off the paint. 2 cooks into it and 80% of the paint on the fire box has flaked off.


Medic Smoker: Hopefully, you'll try the paints I mentioned. The paint has nothing to do with the cooking aspect but I like nice looking stuff. When folks see my cooker, their eyes first go to the flaking paint.  

The 1000* temp paints don't work and are a waste of money but formerly  it was my only choice. They make the fire box look nice but after a couple of cooks you're back with the flaking paint. The trick is to sand the fire box down to bare metal using metal sandpaper. Just roughing up the surface ends up with a messy looking paint job because you can't "feather" in the edges or cover the scratches. Adding extra coats doesn't work either -- it's just more paint that will eventually flake. One item I considered was applying a primer but the directions on the can say not to. I don't know the answer but I hope the paint I was turned onto solves the problem.

I read on another forum that Lang had purchased an adjacent building at their facility where they were going to powder coat and make covers. I don't know how true that is but it doesn't help you or me.
medic smoker

after some research i think i am going to go with VHT 2000 degree paint.  I will agree, the paint has nothing to do with how it cooks.  Its all cosmetic. The smoker preformed well. The only I am having paint issue is around the fire box. I will post pictures after i paint it.
medic smoker

so, i finally got around to painting the fire box.  I sanded the box with an angle grinder got most of the paint off. i went ahead and got the VHT 2000 degree paint flat black $8.99 at the local auto part store. So far i put on one coat on, rained a few hours after. held up great and came out pretty good.  I have cooked on it a few times since, no flaking or peeling.  The flat black turns a little grey, doesn't match the lang color paint, but that is not that big of a deal for me. I am just worried about rust.  if you would like pics, let me know.
dsarphie

Interesting.  I'd like to see a pic.

I posted a week ago about some people I had met who said that they gave up on trying to paint.  They sprayed Pam on the firebox after each cook.  I rubbed vegetable oil on the top of mine and it worked great to hide the discoloration from the rust.
medic smoker

[img[/img]
[img][/img]
[img][/img]
[img][/img]
[img][/img]

not the best pics.
medic smoker

the last two pics or so are after i painted it. has one coat of paint total. has about 4 cooks with the paint on, so far
Raineman

I decided against re painting after more research. It seems that many end up repainting the box annually to keep it up anyway, even with the good paint. Only the paint on the front of the firebox bubbled and flaked on mine.

Based on that, 2 cooks ago I scraped off any bubbling, flaking paint with a scraper. No sanding. I did not touch the paint on any other part of the firebox. Then I sprayed Pam on liberally over the whole firebox before, during and after the last 2 cooks, even over the paint that was not effected. It now has the texture of a cast iron pan and looks awesome. I did use almost a full large can of Pam in that short amount of time. Now that I have a good base, I will repeat this each time I use it. However, I don't think I need to use as much Pam going forward now that the base is set. No additional paint has bubbled or flaked since

Will keep you posted.
hugoice

Pam or vegetable oil is all I use and mine still looks brand new.
Raineman

hugoice wrote:
Pam or vegetable oil is all I use and mine still looks brand new.



I think that's the way to go. Very impressed so far with the results
KevinWI

have same issue on top of my firebox....I have a cover but it still bubbled/rusted...
I like keeping my cooker looking pretty. Will try to sand it out and paint next spring...too cold here now for next 6 months
Wood River BBQ Team

KevinWI wrote:
have same issue on top of my firebox....I have a cover but it still bubbled/rusted...
I like keeping my cooker looking pretty. Will try to sand it out and paint next spring...too cold here now for next 6 months


I also like my cooker looking like the day it was delivered -- I like shiney cars and boats. My cook chamber looks great because I coat it with Walmart peanut oil. The only section that obviously takes a beating is the fire box, which is understandable due to the high temerature. I tested the temperature  once at the fire with a heat gun but I can't find the results - I think the top was in the 500* range and the sides were close to that temperature. Because I have fire bricks in the bottom and the door is air tight,  my sides and especially the top are going to take a beating.

Personally, because of the high temperature generated in the fire box, I don't think there is a solution to the flaking paint. I don't think peanut oil or Pam on top of paint will prevent flaking. The problem is the paint Lang uses. One could sand the fire box to bare metal and season it like a cast iron pan but I would not like the contrast between the cook chamber and the fire box but that's just me.

Hopefully, Raineman's solution will work because it will save me some time -- it doesn't take me long to hit the top with a sander and spray high gloss but it would be one less thing to do. My neighbor has a Peoria Custom Cooker and he doesn't have a flaking problem. I don't know what kind of paint PCC uses but it sure does the job.l
hugoice

I started oiling mine the first time I used it and every time since and mine has no paint flaking off.still looks brand new.
JDNC

Well I've been lurking here gathering some great info prior to my purchase of a Lang 36.

This paint flaking has got my attention.  My .02 is that due to some having paint flake and some not, I really don't think its due to using or not using cooking oil on the surface but probably due to the paint being applied with moisture on the bare metal surface at Lang's.

Years ago when I helped in a auto body shop I was taught to heat the metal with a propane torch prior to applying bon-do. The metal looked dry but as it was heated you could see the water vapor leave the surface. Now granted, the torch was creating some of this condensation but my point is, if paint was applied over moisture/water it's not not going to stay.

If I have this problem with paint flaking off, I'm going to sand blast the area, then heat it to make sure it's dry before painting.  If that doesn't work, I'll be back here lurking!

Hope this might help,

JD
JDNC

I guess to sum up my thoughts is that it's probably not the paint but the application.  If there is moisture, grease, wax etc. under the paint it's not going to stay put.

JD
KevinWI

it's occurring at the hottest part of the firebox. That is no coincidence.

Just ordered the automotive high heat rustoleum from Amazon $7.49

good to 2000F
They sell one for BBQ, but it's only rated at 1000F
JDNC

How hot do you think that area gets?  I just don't understand why some flake and some don't.  If it's the paint, Lang must be using different types.  As for temps of the metal, it would be glowing red if is over 900 or so.

Beats me, but I really don't think cooking oil on top of paint is the answer.  I still think it has something to do with metal surface prep prior to painting.  I reserve my right to being wrong Laughing

JD
KevinWI

have no oil on my firebox....on mine at least....its rusting. it's not a big deal.....I'll clean it up with a flap disc on my angle grinder and repaint. Oil will protect from moisture sitting on the top of the box....only flat surface exposed to extreme temp variations. cover or not, condensation still occurr and sits on top
JDNC

I agree, the cover can cause condensation problems as the sun comes out. It's so, dusty here in the summer I think oil on the outside would cause me more problems than the rust. I would have to pressure wash before every cook. In any case, if a solution to the flaking paint can't be found then sanding/blasting and repainting will be the only thing we can do!
Wood River BBQ Team

JDNC wrote:
I agree, the cover can cause condensation problems as the sun comes out. It's so, dusty here in the summer I think oil on the outside would cause me more problems than the rust. I would have to pressure wash before every cook. In any case, if a solution to the flaking paint can't be found then sanding/blasting and repainting will be the only thing we can do!



JDNC: Thanks for the tip on drying the surface before painting. My process has been to sand and then apply the paint, which works for 3 or 4 cooks, and then I have to do the process over. Next time I'll use a torch first or just let the surface bake for a few hours in the AZ sun. I didn't get 3 or 4 cooks out of the Lang when it was delivered -- it flaked at the first cook.

Collecting dust -- It's dusty in my area also and even though my Lang is covered, the peanut oil collects dirt. I have to wipe down the cook chamber with a wet rag before I cook. My cook chamber looks like new. When I paint the fire box with high gloss paint the whole rig looks like
new. I paid over $1500 for my rig, which is not much compared to what some Lang owners have invested, but I don't want it to look like some cheapo rust bucket. This cooker is one of the focal points of my backyard BBQ area and I want it to look nice.

Last night I cooked chicken on a Weber 22.5 kettle. The temp gauge showed 350* and I think the actual temp might be a bit higher. I don't know what Weber's paint process is but I never seen a Weber with a paint problem.
JDNC

WR,
I hope to keep mine in good shape also when I get it.  

In reference to painting I would also use a solvent like acetone or MEK in a spray bottle and flood the surface to clean any grease, wax etc. after sanding.  If you sand blast you might just get away with spraying and no wipe down, and let it dry in the sun.  If the surface is 150 degrees or so (and it will be in the sun) it should be dry with your low humidity.  Just don't coat with paint to heavy and maybe it will stay put.

I mean you can only try!

JD
KevinWI

Bought a can of the high heat rustoleum from Amazon. Recommends priming first for best adhesion.
JDNC

KevinWI

Is this in a spray can?  I also picked up a can and mine reads " priming not recommended".  Beats me.  I have Rust-oleum high heat. Say's it will resist heat up to 1200.  I bought it a few days ago but have not used it.
Wood River BBQ Team

JDNC wrote:
KevinWI

Is this in a spray can? I also picked up a can and mine reads " priming not recommended". Beats me. I have Rust-oleum high heat. Say's it will resist heat up to 1200. I bought it a few days ago but have not used it.



The Rust-oleum, which is flat black and mine is a spray can, works on my rig for 3 or 4 cooks and then starts to blister. The ACE heat resistant, which is gloss black and looks better, is good up to 1000* but I get the same results as with Rust-oleum. The ACE paint is probably made by Rust-oleum.  The label says it will withstand 1000* intermittently and 800* constantly.

I've given up on those 2 products. What I'm going to try next is either of the 2 products I suggested early on in this topic. They are Autozone 2000* ThermoTec or O'Reilly's VHT Ceramic Header 2000*.  With either of those 2000* paints I'm going to follow the directions on the can instead of just slapping on the paint and I'm going to prepare the surface as outlined by JDNC.  

When I was searching for a solution I thought a primer might be the answer but most spray's said not to use a primer. Additionally, maybe brush on paint would work better than the spray.

I checked out my neighbors fire box on his Peoria Custom Cooker -- one reason he doesn't have a paint problem on his fire box is because it's INSULATED. Every time he jabed me about the paint on my Lang, he left that out of the conversation!!
JDNC

WR,
Ive also read that on high temp paints to only use a very thin coat and only two at most.  Also to cure by using a moderate temp not really hot the first time.

I don't have a clue if this true as I have not used high temps paint other than on cheap gas grills and didn't really care one way or the other.  I do think metal prep is a given though.

JD
Wood River BBQ Team

JDNC wrote:
WR,
Ive also read that on high temp paints to only use a very thin coat and only two at most. Also to cure by using a moderate temp not really hot the first time.

I don't have a clue if this true as I have not used high temps paint other than on cheap gas grills and didn't really care one way or the other. I do think metal prep is a given though.

JD


Today, I noticed one of my neighbors working on the manifold of his motor bike. He was painting it with VHT ceramic 2000*. He says it works great. Only problem is he has to wait until his wife leaves so he can bake the manifold in the kitchen oven!!. He thinks neither that product or Thermotec will work on the Lang or any BBQ due to the curing process required. He did suggest I look at KBS XTREME which might work due to a different curing procees that maybe could be controlled using the fire box temperature.
JDNC

FWIW Ive had my 36 Patio since before Xmas and cooked on it about a dozen times.  Recently I noticed very small flaking on the surface of the fire box.

I cleaned it with MEK and put two light coats of Stove Brite High Temp satin finish paint on it.  It appears to be working ok.  I have not had any bubbling as some have discribed, but I'll see.

I don't know what type or brand paint Lang uses but it has a shiny satin appearence as the satin I used is somewhat flatter.  But on the firebox it's going to get flat anyway!

       lang.myfreeforum.org Forum Index -> Ask about Lang Cookers
Page 1 of 1
Create your own free forum | Buy a domain to use with your forum